In this solo episode, Dan breaks down the recapitalization: selling part of your business, keeping part of it, and getting paid a second time when the platform sells again. He runs the actual math on a $2M EBITDA business — what $8 million at close plus a 20% rolled stake really turns into five years later — and then argues the other side, honestly, because the grind path can print a bigger number.

He also covers what nobody mentions in the pitch: debt sits ahead of your rolled equity, and that piece is real money at real risk. Only roll what you can afford to lose.

Plus: why Carrie Kelsch turned down a $30 million unsolicited offer and rolled 100% of her equity instead, and why most buyers usually prefer a seller who stays in with skin in the game.

This isn't a pitch for recaps. It's a case for making a decision instead of defaulting into one.

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New episodes drop every other week. Catch them all at AftertheClosePodcast.com.

Everything on this show is for informational purposes only and isn't financial, legal, or tax advice. Talk to your own advisors before making any decisions on a deal.

Thinking about your own exit? Receive a free Opinion of Value and catch every other episode at AfterTheClosePodcast.com.

In this episode, Patrick and Dan get into the real mechanics: why he skipped a full QoE and what he'd do differently, how 500 cold emails turned into six LOIs and his first deal, why buying multiple firms is far harder than it looks, and the four reasons QoE deals fall apart in diligence. Patrick also makes the case that self-funded searchers shouldn't try to look like private equity, because "it's not crowded at the finish line."

A candid, numbers-forward conversation for anyone thinking about buying a business, selling one, or growing through acquisition in the lower middle market.

Find Patrick on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pdichter/

Twitter: https://x.com/patrickdichter, or search Appletree Business Services.

Get every episode at AftertheClosePodcast.com.

Boris Berenberg spent six and a half years building Atlas Authority into one of the top Atlassian partner businesses in the world. Tens of millions in lifetime revenue, high single-digit millions in ARR, 10,000+ customers, fully bootstrapped. In 2022, he sold to a private equity rollup. The check cleared. The regret showed up shortly after.

This conversation is a postmortem on a deal that closed but didn't deliver. Boris is candid about the bidding process he ran among friendly competitors, why he now believes a real advisor would have produced a dramatically different outcome, and how selling inside your own ecosystem can cause you to leave money on the table.

The deeper story is about what the sale revealed. Boris talks through a values exercise he completed after closing, the gap between wealth and cash flow, and why most exited founders he knows did not actually retire. He also gets tactical on what he wishes he had figured out years before going to market, including tax structure, seller notes, and how to use AI to pressure test a deal thesis before you ever sign an LOI.

For any owner thinking about an exit, this is the conversation worth hearing before you sign anything.

In this episode:

• The annual "birthday bidding process" Boris ran on himself for years
• Why selling to buyers who know your space too well can backfire
• Wealth versus cash flow, and which one most founders actually want
• The post-close values exercise that reframed the whole experience
• What Boris would have negotiated differently on transition and structure
• The right way to use AI when you are preparing to sell

Guest: Boris Berenberg, founder of Atlas Authority (exited 2022), now building z0.ai Host: Dan Stetser

New episodes every other week ataftertheclosepodcast.com

In this episode, Jeff walks through both deals: the PE buyer who dragged him through five months of due diligence, ran up $50K in professional fees, and then rewrote the terms on closing day. He also breaks down the strategic acquirer who ultimately bought the business with a structure that worked for both sides.

You'll hear how Jeff negotiated his initial offer of 3x EBITDA up to nearly 5x through a creative earnout, why the buyer's willingness to funnel work into Paper Leaf made the performance targets actually achievable, and what the three-year transition period looked like from the inside.

Whether you're years away from a sale or actively fielding interest, this conversation covers the real mechanics of how deals get structured, how they fall apart, and what separates a good outcome from a bad one.